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Topic: Knit against Nike!  (Read 3579 times)
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nixx
« Reply #10 on: July 08, 2005 05:10:35 PM »

vanessa's right.  what she said is one part of the story.  here's another.  did you know that in some third world countries, only girls aged around 14-16 are forced to work in order to pay off debts that their families were unfairly put in, in the first place?  they are sold just so their family can eat.  and yes, most of the people that work in sweat shops are kids so they'll want to play, but there are actually places that will torture the poor children by burning them with hot rods when they take a break to play.  and there are even more serious cases where young women are not allowed to get pregnant because the people running the sweat shops do not want to give them a maternity leave.  so instead, they are forced to take birth control pills.  if the owners discover a girl is not taking them, they are beaten.  and if by some chance the girl still becomes pregnant, they are forced buy a really expensive shot to abort the baby and put them even further into debt.  as if that's not enough, do you know what the hours are for them?  people will work 20 or more hours of the day, with those extra hours to eat and sleep.

i understand that sweatshops help families survive, but it's the conditions in most of these places that have me bothered.  it's honestly really sad how many people don't even give a damn.  just last year, i tried to get signatures for a petition to create better conditions for workers in sweatshops, and most of the people i told about it just looked at me dumbfounded as if there weren't even a brain in their head.  it's really upsetting.  i just wish someone would take a stand for them.

making the quilt won't stop sweat shops, but it will make more people aware of what's going on and hopefully the workers over there will be able to see that we understand, support and care about them.  trust me, they'd appreciate it.
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« Reply #11 on: July 08, 2005 06:05:07 PM »

There is no excuse for sweatshop conditions.   Safety standards need to be improved, basic human rights need to be observed, environmental impact research needs to be made (I read that in Asia 3 Million people DIE from industrial pollution.)

Earing $1 a day for a 9 hour shift is what you have to do when your country is going through an industrial revolution  (as Vanessa pointed out from her experience in third world sweatshops that she alluded to.)  While third-world workers may be thrilled that they can possably work 90 hour work weeks for a few months to finally afford a mosquito net and avoid insect carrying diseases (while the first-world store that sells the items make record profits.)  There is no reason why their bare minimum basic human rights shouldn't be met.

Some people read about torture and imprisonment in sweatshops and knit petitions.  Others shrug their shoulders and say, "hey at least they were getting paid."  One responce is a little silly but at least active.     ...
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« Reply #12 on: July 14, 2005 11:15:56 AM »

the blanket is infact a simple petition. but its a good one. a sheet of paper with a thousand signatures will get glanced and and maybe to companies it will say something, good and everything but petitions like the blankey are cool in that being a bright big visual blanket means other people see it. youre educating people about the problems. believe it or not most people dont take a second thought about stuff like that. personally i try not to buy products that were "made in india" or something. am i starving the poor sweat shop workers? probably not.if enough people stop buying products made in "less than satiss-factorys" and let the operators know why they projects sugh as this one will have paid off. Vanessa Cyanide is pretty much right. a project like this doesnt do any good if theres no action behind the voice. letting phil  know youre not happy with him and then buying his shoes does nothing. hes got no reason to stop. 
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« Reply #13 on: August 07, 2005 09:40:22 AM »

I remember we discussed Sweatshops in my Philosophy 281: Ethics class. 

The problem: say there is a Nike factory in China.  Petitions, protests, etc call for better work conditions.  Now, the company can spend $2 million to fix up the Chinese factory, or they can spend $1 million to move to India, where there are just as many desperate workers.  In fact, by moving the factory you are allowing those Chinese workers to starve to death, because there are no other jobs available to them.  The problem is that there are always more people who are desperate, in other poor contries willing to turn a blind eye.  Why do you think there are almost no fabric factories in America anymore?  The cost would be too much, given the minimum wage and the safety laws.

This is not to say I like Sweatshops.  However, until all the countries of the world have all their people living comfortably, it will be impossible to stamp them out because someone, somewhere will be willing to work in inhumane cinditions to support their family. 
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« Reply #14 on: August 07, 2005 06:52:06 PM »

I dont know how many people have actually been to 3rd world contries on craftster, here. but if you have, you probably have more insight as to how the sweat shops actually help the people. sure, child labor is bad, and kids should have time to be kids, but in a situation where you either work or starve to death, i think youd pick work. and yes, i do think the wages should be higher, and the conditions should be better, but to these people that make so little every day, it is enough for them to keep on living.Theres always 2 sides to every story...the people that might be forced to do this sweat shop labor may have an alterior motive...ie: making their lives better. I know I will probably offend a lot of people, and I really dont care. I do think you should look at matters from their situation too. And Im sure Im not the only person that feels this way. Also, so many people that are against all these sweat shops DO support it in one way or another. Where do you think those clothes, that say "Made in China" came from? And for the workers to make $2.00 an hour, is actually quite a lot in 3rd world contries. $2.00 us an hour in China is $16.00 for them. Thats a lot. That will feed a whole family for at least 2 days. This is just my 2 cents from seeing things from another perspective. Take it how you like, but really, knitting against nike isnt going to do anything.

Damn this is exactly what I think about Walmart stuff. Because I was in Economics once and had to ask my teacher why people hate Walmart, and he made a good point that people who otherwise wouldnt have jobs, have jobs and get paid when they wouldnt if wal mart companies werent there. Yea it's cheaper for wal mart, but it helps them (the other countried) too. And so what if the rest of the people in the US don't have more wal mart factory jobs...

Anyway, I say if you want to stop a factory, try to create something else equally as beneficial.

I wore Nikes as a kid, what of it?
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« Reply #15 on: August 09, 2005 06:40:11 PM »

Good idea, but i can see nike turning it around and using in an ad to support their company. and it will be done so easily
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« Reply #16 on: August 27, 2005 06:39:41 PM »

i get what Vanessa Cyanide is saying about there being 2 sides to everything and i think it is untrue to say that nothing good comes out of the situation. But i do thnik that those of us who the companies listen to (or rather they listen to our money) have the right to say/demand that all people in this world have a certain standard of care/safety at work. i dont think it is unreasonable to tell companies that we will not buy their products unless they provide their employees with a safe working environment. Not all countries have the safety regulations that we have and while Nike may be acting in accordance with the laws of a certain country, we know that that countries' standards may be lower than are humane. I think part of the arguement is always that companies dont put their employees' safety high enough on their priority list since there is an inexhaustable source of new workers in may countries since as you say they "work or starve."

simply saying that it is too big a problem is not an excuse to do nothing. People have said causes were too big all throughout history and they were commonly wrong. it just takes a loto f people and heaven forbid, a lot of work, lol. If a large enough group of people refused to buy Nikes for a year, lets say, and said that no matter where a factory was, we think the workers should be treated humanely, Nike would comply, because they'd be losing $$$. And that seems to be the bottom line.
and as for me, it may be true that this petition wont do anything but i refuse to let that be my excuse for not trying to do anything. i think it's better to try and fail than admit defeat before i even try. And at the very least i will feel less guilty about and opressed by a situation that seems too large to fight.

here are some quotes:
"If you think you are too small to make a difference, try sleeping in a closed room with a mosquito." -African Proverb
"Every man is guilty of all the good he didnt do" -Voltaire   scary thought, lol
"We cannot appeal to the conscience of the world when our own conscience is asleep."  -Carl Von Ossietzky
"If you want world peace fight for justice"
"The man who says it cannot be done should not interrupt the person doing it." -Chinese Proverb
"first they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win" -Gandhi
« Last Edit: August 27, 2005 06:57:49 PM by askaboutrpickles » THIS ROCKS   Logged

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« Reply #17 on: August 29, 2005 12:20:09 AM »

That's just the thing that's so galling, though, is that often Americn companies who look elsewhere for cheap labor don't even bother to follow the meagre labor laws of that country, because they know they aren't being enforced anyway.

They're not saying Close Factories, they're saying Close Sweatshops.
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« Reply #18 on: May 17, 2006 06:45:37 PM »

I dont know how many people have actually been to 3rd world contries on craftster, here. but if you have, you probably have more insight as to how the sweat shops actually help the people. sure, child labor is bad, and kids should have time to be kids, but in a situation where you either work or starve to death, i think youd pick work. and yes, i do think the wages should be higher, and the conditions should be better, but to these people that make so little every day, it is enough for them to keep on living.Theres always 2 sides to every story...the people that might be forced to do this sweat shop labor may have an alterior motive...ie: making their lives better. I know I will probably offend a lot of people, and I really dont care. I do think you should look at matters from their situation too. And Im sure Im not the only person that feels this way. Also, so many people that are against all these sweat shops DO support it in one way or another. Where do you think those clothes, that say "Made in China" came from? And for the workers to make $2.00 an hour, is actually quite a lot in 3rd world contries. $2.00 us an hour in China is $16.00 for them. Thats a lot. That will feed a whole family for at least 2 days. This is just my 2 cents from seeing things from another perspective. Take it how you like, but really, knitting against nike isnt going to do anything.

Have you seen The Corporation?
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« Reply #19 on: May 18, 2006 08:36:26 AM »

HOLY OLD THREAD BATMAN!

no i have no clue what the Corporation is unless you are referring to any corporation in general...
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