A Crafts Community For Craft Ideas & DIY Projects - Craftster.org
Help | About | Contact | Press | Advertise | Terms | Site Map
Welcome, Guest.
Please login or register.
Random Tip: When you post a project, it's easier for people to discover it if you choose a great title for your thread.
Total Members: 296,388
Currently Running With Scissors:
721 Guests and 32 Users
Home Craftster Community Crafting Articles Craft Tutorials My Craftster Crafting Calendar City Guides Craft Shop


Pages: [1]
Jump to page:
  Show Images Only     Send this topic  |  Print  |  Bookmark  
Topic: Help decoding Old knitting patterns  (Read 1561 times)
Tags for this thread:  Add new tag
Share the love... Pin it Submit to reddit add to Wists
1+
 
tigerEyes
Super Flirt! *wink*
Offline Offline

Posts: 146
Joined: 24-Nov-2003


View Profile WWW
« on: November 08, 2004 06:15:30 PM »

I checked out a book with traditional knitting patterns from Europe.  The problem is the book was written in 1962, so the language is not up to date. Here is what I need deciphered into today's knitting language.

w.f.            Wool foward
w.o.n.        Wool on needle
w.r.n.         Wool round needle
K or P t.b.l.          Through back of loop
k.b.           Knit into back of stitch

*the book is "Traditional Knitting Patterns..." by James Norbury"
« Last Edit: November 09, 2004 04:21:54 AM by tigerEyes » THIS ROCKS   Logged

I get sh*t done!
starlings
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2004 07:45:26 PM »



wool forward = yarn forward/yarn over
wool on needle? = I have no idea.  For this, I'd need a context in which it is used. Is it possible that it's a crochet term? Or could it be just another way of saying wf/yo?
wool round needle = I think this is like a 360-degree yarn over, where you're wrapping the yarn fully around the needle. Often you drop the extra loop off on the following row.
Ktbl, ptbl = these are in current use. To ktbl, rather than inserting your needle through the front of the stitch, you sneak it through the back, like so:
http://knitting.about.com/library/bllearnktbl.htm

to purl tbl, do this:
http://knitting.about.com/library/bllearnptbl.htm

k.b.= this must be the same as ktbl - unless...it may be used in kf&b or k1kb or something: an increase where you knit into the front and back of the same stitch

well, i tried.
THIS ROCKS   Logged
tigerEyes
Super Flirt! *wink*
Offline Offline

Posts: 146
Joined: 24-Nov-2003


View Profile WWW
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2004 04:33:51 AM »



wool forward = yarn forward/yarn over
wool on needle? = I have no idea.  For this, I'd need a context in which it is used. Is it possible that it's a crochet term? Or could it be just another way of saying wf/yo?
wool round needle = I think this is like a 360-degree yarn over, where you're wrapping the yarn fully around the needle. Often you drop the extra loop off on the following row.
Ktbl, ptbl = these are in current use. To ktbl, rather than inserting your needle through the front of the stitch, you sneak it through the back, like so:
http://knitting.about.com/library/bllearnktbl.htm

to purl tbl, do this:
http://knitting.about.com/library/bllearnptbl.htm

k.b.= this must be the same as ktbl - unless...it may be used in kf&b or k1kb or something: an increase where you knit into the front and back of the same stitch

well, i tried.

Thanks for your help.  Here is how wool on needle and wool round needle is used in this pattern.

Madeira Mesh Pattern Spain
Multiple of 6 + 7
1st-6th rows: K2, * w.r.n., p3tog, w.o.n., k3, rep. from *, w.o.n., k2.
7th-12th rows: K2, *k3, w.r.n., p3tog, w.o.n., rep. from *, k5

Also k2tog tbl and p2tog tbl is how tbl is used in the pattern that I'm copied.
THIS ROCKS   Logged

I get sh*t done!
subloke
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2004 07:53:23 AM »

I checked out a book with traditional knitting patterns from Europe.  The problem is the book was written in 1962, so the language is not up to date. Here is what I need deciphered into today's knitting language.

w.f.            Wool foward
w.o.n.        Wool on needle
w.r.n.         Wool round needle
K or P t.b.l.          Through back of loop
k.b.           Knit into back of stitch

*the book is "Traditional Knitting Patterns..." by James Norbury"

Wool Forward is when you switch the yarn between being held in back and being held in front, ie when you go to purl

Wool on needle:  I've been trying to figure this one out since my mom gave me her old "Mon Tricot Knitting Dictionary" published in France (with British- English terminology) in 1972-- my source for what i'm writing here.  I found a stitch description that uses w.o.n. between a p2 and a k1 to make an increase.  So, my thought is that it is a YO increase between a purl and a knit.  I can't find any better description

Wool round needle is the same as when modern patterns say "YO" to increase.  (especially in a knit row as the yarn actually goes all the way around the needle)

K/P TBL is in fact Knit/purl through back loop

K B:  I have usually seen this written "K1B" and usually means "Knit 1 into row below" like what is used in the Brioche stitch (which I can not do to save my life) -- so I'm not sure that this (what I wrote) is what your book means
THIS ROCKS   Logged

if you can't be a good example then you'll just have to be a horrible warning.

http://yesimadethat.blogspot.com
melidomi
Friend of Craftster Friend of Craftster

Offline Offline

Posts: 1888
Joined: 28-Nov-2003

knit like the wind!


View Profile
« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2004 08:19:33 AM »

Wool on needle:  I've been trying to figure this one out since my mom gave me her old "Mon Tricot Knitting Dictionary" published in France (with British- English terminology) in 1972-- my source for what i'm writing here.  I found a stitch description that uses w.o.n. between a p2 and a k1 to make an increase.  So, my thought is that it is a YO increase between a purl and a knit.  I can't find any better description
Hmm, sounds to me like a make 1 increase.  Where you knit into the running yarn between two stitches.
THIS ROCKS   Logged
ookpik
Offline Offline

Posts: 675
Joined: 22-Mar-2004

everything is so neat!


View Profile WWW
« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2004 12:19:43 PM »

Hark! A written definition from an old patons book! I quote:

"wool forward" - w.fwd. ....is bringing the wool between 2 knit
stitches

"wool on needle" - w.o.n.......is the same action between a purl and
a knit stitch

"wool round the needle" - w.r.n.......is the same action between two
purl stitches or between a knit stitch and a purl stitch

So in my estimation, all of them have since been condensed to just "yarn over = y.o."

In that case, since all those w.r.n's and w.o.n's are increases that aren't worked on an existing stitch, those sample row instructions are b0rked. how can "k2 *6 sts in, 6sts out* yo k2" be worked on a multiple of 6 + 7?? That is a multiple of 6 + 4. The first 6 rows are also increasing 1 every row, which screws up the repeatability of those instructions. I don't get it. Do they really mean "K to end"? That would work, since by the end of the 6th row, there would be 6 increases to make one complete pattern repeat in time for row 7 to start fresh.

Anyway. Over-analyst over and out.
THIS ROCKS   Logged

There's no such thing as too much information, so: All About My Vagina
starlings
« Reply #6 on: November 09, 2004 07:54:59 PM »

Aha! ookpik! You've cracked the code. As soon as tigerEyes posted the pattern excerpt, it was much clearer.  Imagine - three different terms for the basic yarn over!

I also agree that the pattern seems kind of wonk, but I haven't the energy to drag out my needles and try.  Maybe tomorrow.
THIS ROCKS   Logged
lkcunning
« Reply #7 on: November 10, 2004 04:02:57 PM »

You could also check out the Madeira Mesh pattern that Barbara Walker has in one of her books. I know she has one, but it might not be the same pattern. Her directions are impeccable, so it's worth a look.
THIS ROCKS   Logged
tigerEyes
Super Flirt! *wink*
Offline Offline

Posts: 146
Joined: 24-Nov-2003


View Profile WWW
« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2004 10:58:54 AM »

subloke, starlings, and ookpik: After I posted the pattern, I went to knitting.about.com and I found out the meaning to all those "won, wf, wrn" which are yarn overs.  Who knew the same term can be expressed in different ways.

As for the pattern being wonk, I'll have to test it out this weekend and I'll post the results.  I have four other patterns to check as well from the same book.

lkcunning: I'll check for that next time I'm at the library.
THIS ROCKS   Logged

I get sh*t done!
tigerEyes
Super Flirt! *wink*
Offline Offline

Posts: 146
Joined: 24-Nov-2003


View Profile WWW
« Reply #9 on: December 22, 2004 03:57:21 PM »

Hey, I know it's been awhile since I said I'd do a sample of the patterns but now I have some time to whip them up.  Here's the first one:

Madeira Leaf Pattern

The pattern as follows:
Cast on multiple of 12 + 5
Rows 1-6: K2, *k1, yo, k4, p3tog, k4, yo, rep. from *, k3.
Rows 7-12: K2 p2tog, *k4, yo, k1, yo, k4, p3tog, rep. from *, k4, yo, k1, yo, k4, p2tog, k2.
Repeat these rows to form pattern.

However in my sample I had to omit the * section in rows 7-12 because it didn't make sense with the number of stitches I cast on with.
THIS ROCKS   Logged

I get sh*t done!
Threads you might like:
Pages: [1] Jump to page:
  Send this topic  |  Print  |  Bookmark  
 
Jump to:  



only results with images
include swap threads
advanced search



your ad could be here!

How-To Videos
Author Tom Brokaw on the Best Day in His Life
Lynda Obst on Hollywood and Foreign Markets
Family Celebrations with Buddy Valastro
Norman Mailer’s “Double Life” as a Writer
Terra McVoy: What Are You Reading?
Latest Blog Articles
DIY Summer
Craft Challenge 101 Announced - Stash Buster
July 8, 2014 Featured Projects

Comparison Shopping




Support Craftster
Become a
Friend of Craftster

Buy Craftster Swag
Buy Craft Supplies
Comparison Shopping

Craftster heartily thanks the following peeps...
Moderators

Follow Craftster...






Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC
SimplePortal 2.3.5 © 2008-2012, SimplePortal
Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!

Copyright ©2003-2014, Craftster.org an Internet Brands company.